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Tbh, I wouldn't find cash so boring if it wasnt just so heavily reliant on finding out which villians are just nuts peddlers. Obv we don't wanna be playing against brilliant players a lot better than us, and its good for us when people are see-through in their style, but just fels pretty boring when you get 3bet and the number of people you can say 'ok so that's JJ+ or AK (maybe AQ if we're lucky)'. Before anyone says it, I know this is good from a winnimg sense, but from an enjoyment sense imo it sucks.
But w/e money you win at cash it's alwasy relative to your BR.
Essentially you get to a point where you play poker not just for fun because you have an expectation of winning.
When that doesn't happen then your like it's not fun.
Do you enjoy poker more when your winning and things are going good ?
You have a job, like me so get realsitic your never going to make big enough money to leave your job.
Maybe in 2-3 years time you may have worked your way up enough to do this but for now you need to think about what you want to acheive.
Me, I am happy if I win enough each month to treat the kids to something.
Plus I still play cash to pay for my MTT entries as you know one day I am going to win massive )
take care Paul, don't think about the amount of time you put in against the return - seriously your not a pro. If you win then a little money for your gf and a new pair of shoes - all helps.
run good
My advice would be spend your roll on whatever games you fancy playing e.g. if there is a big tourny you fancy playing or a juicy cash game then just play and dont worry about what happens, then if your bankroll goes ( which i'm sure it wudnt) you could just work out what surplus money you can afford to spend on your hobby every month and carry on as above playing games you enjoy with no real pressure to build and build.
Finally once you have had a few days to reflect i'm sure you will be remotivated to crush again, you don't seem the type to just give up. I would say if your spending 20 hours a week playing, then take a few hours of the time a week to study the game, just read and read. That helped me personally, this time last year i kind of knew how to play the game but would never of been profitable long term, just a standard break even player that would splash around, but i got hold of aload of pdfs (would happily share what i have) and just read and read all sorts of stuff, can be boring at times but there is nothing better than reading a golden piece of information or strategy that makes something just click in your way of thinking and apporach to the game.
All this stuff you say about poker and people 3 betting a narrow range, this is the essence of poker dude.
Adjust, adapt, exploit - it's not easy unless your stacking fish tbh )
I could write you a book about tight robotic regs, but they are winners.
Yes it's pretty predictable and boring and pretty much relies on coolers and stacking fish but hey cmon Paul how easy is it to adjust to someone that doesn't adjust.
This stuff above is the fun in poker dude - your missing it )
Can I just say that for someone who does spreadsheets, thinks about c4p - and has grinded forever -
Try not looking at your BR amount or any spreadshets for a month.
Just play and concentrate on making good choices at the table.
Look at hands etc.. examine them - go to deueces cracked try the 7 day trail - watch videos -
may breath some life into your game and open your mind a bit
Yeah I have no illusions of quitting my job from poker, certainly not while playing 20NL lol, but if I'm doing something that feels like a grind I want it to be worthwhile. Like say I was making £1000 per month but feeling like I am now, I'd think the grind was worth the payoff cos tbh that's how I feel about my job. It's not like I love my job but the wages pay well enough to do something that isn't the most interesting thing in the world.
That is the difference, I don't feel like MTTs are a grind so it's not like I have to win to make it worthwhile cos it was worthwhile for the fun I got from it whether I win or lose.
You may have touched on another point there Rancid in that I never withdraw funds from Sky ever, and so perhaps am not seeing the fruits of my labour, other than to see a number I post here everyday going up or down.
Another problem of mine is being far too stubborn. Sometimes it can be a good trait but sometimes it can be a right pain in the @$$. I'm being driven mad by cash but it's the only format of the game I'm not in profit with since I started Sky (I think). Some may say well that's a reason to play the other games you do beat, others may say well get better and beat this format too. I dunno, certainly not worth stressing about.
That's why I choose to never play cash. I don't care if it's more profitable in theory than tournament play, I'd rather watch paint dry than play a cash game. Everybody is different and I salute the cash specialists, I have absolutely nothing against them. It's just that as far as I'm concerned nothing in the game is more exciting than a deep tournament run.
That last bit may be a decent idea, I'm fanatical about that kinda thing and it's really hard to stop, like even mid session I've mentally remembered how much I've topped up for etc so I havea rough idea of whether I'm up or down, gotta get out of that habit. Maybe click on hide balance for a month and never look for the whole month.
Yeah a good amount of my roll has been built from playing HU SnGs, I'm sure I could go back to them, just dunno what I wannd ao atm. By the way, you've been doing pretty amazing in your diary, can't believe how quickly you've built a 4 figure roll!
I can handle the losing, although obviously losing at 100NL for instance would be new to me and would probably hurt a little at first. My tilt/frustration usually comes from being angry with myself after a slightly lapse in concentration for a minute causes me to pay off some nit reg robot when if I was fully focussed I could fold
Think it's too early to conclude 'you can't make money @ cash' Paul.
It's a knee jerk reaction to a bad session.
Splash has already mentioned a couple of the stack offs were total spew, and you've agreed with him.
That's nothing to do with ability.
If you give up on it now, think of all the time, effort and money (coaching) you will have wasted on trying to make it work. As a nit, surely you can't put that much in and then fold
Give it a few more months. Play more, post less, see if you can get somewhere.
Roll is still fine, gl.
Aint posted here for a little while. Still been playing but no cash (up until tonight), just had a few days of just playing whatever I feel like. Played some DYMs (dunno why but I fancied it lol), played some HU SnGs (sticking to Turbos to keep the variance down), and mostly MTTs.
Been running quite well in MTTs.
£5.50 FO
Lambert180 18000 1 £30
richie0710 0 2 £18
farahani 0 3 £12
£5.50 BH HU Shuffle
Lambert180 72500 1 £36.25 + £30.39 Head Prizes 8
£11 £1k BH
1988man 226000 1 £157.92 + £90.59 Head Prizes 8
DZIONIS 0 2 £96.33 + £19.22 Head Prizes 4
lilzane 0 3 £59.33 + £5.86 Head Prizes 1
StayOrGo 0 4 £47.74 + £31.24 Head Prizes 5
127RIBEROT 0 5 £40.68 + £18.16 Head Prizes 2
Lambert180 0 6 £35.03 + £27.66 Head Prizes 6
Pretty sigh that one cos I had a great stack approaching the FT and ran into AA and KK (in the clinic) to leave me as the shorty on the FT.
£5.75 Speed BH
omegga2 80000 1 £37 + £39.43 Head Prizes 10
aub 0 2 £22 + £3.76 Head Prizes 2
Baish 0 3 £15 + £5.64 Head Prizes 3
supersuper 0 4 £11 + £4.22 Head Prizes 2
Lambert180 0 5 £8 + £6.57 Head Prizes 3
Again a bit frustrating to not go deeper
Also got down to the final 3 today in one of them small speeds, can't remember if it was £30 or £50 GTD but down to final 3 with top 2 paid... stacks are 11k (me), 8k and 2k @ 200/400 and somehow I manage to bubble, have no idea how!! Started out by doubling up the shorty jamming BvB J9 into his QQ... always sickening when these people who just wait for hands get one just in the nick of time.
Decided to play some cash tonight too just to get back on the horse, try to go back to basics and get some confidence back. I recently downloaded a snes emulator and was playing that alongside my cash cos I wanted distraction to force me to play a bit tighter but couldn't be bothered mass tabling. Left the table with £50 odd quid (no top ups) so £30odd up there.
BR is £606 atm but I'm gonna take some advice, not post up my BR all the time/not check it all the time. Ignore all the stats/figures and just try to play well.
Finished about £40 up on cash but played a few £5.25 Turbo HU SnGs on the side and won 1/3 so lost about £5 there so about +£35 for the day. Which nearly cancels out the -£40 ish day I had on cash the other day. Frustratingly about £15 of that £40 loss was courtesy of a misclick where I bet £21 instead of £2.10 (I posted this in the FB Forum DTD group).
I even mixed in 1 table of 30NL tonight where I finished +£15, all the same regs I usually see @ 20NL just mentally adjusting to the amounts involved which aren't that different to 20NL anyway.
BR = £597.66
P.S. Pingu - For some reason my points all seemed to come through at the end of the session so finished on about 1250 points.
Hey Paul,
Just wondering when did you stop playing on the 4p tables?
And what did you start with as a bank roll, to build it up?
I'm thinkin about leavin the cash games for a bit, cause it's so swingy. Was thinking about maybe sticking to £1 DYM, and some MTT's, one good run would really set me on the way.
And atleast it would be a bit more constant than just playing cash.
I've played pretty much everything at some point or another. If you go back to Page 1 of this I was playing HU SnGs (Turbo ones) and think I had abuot £150ish when I started them.
I have grinded my way up the lower stakes cash, if you go down the cash route I'd recommend 2p/4p until you get to about £160 then try some 4p/8p but be prepared to move down if things don't start well. Imo 4p/8p is just as easy as 2p/4p but obviously things don't always go your way even when the opponents are terrible so if you lose like 4 BIs (£32) best to just step down for a bit.
The only thing I've never played loads of (surprisingly cos I think I'm quite good at them) is MTTs. In the last 3-4 years I've probably played less than 400 MTTs.
If you're decent which you seem to be, then DYMs are a good way of building a roll as long as you can afford to play £3.30s minimum because anything below that is 15%+ rake and the edge is too small in the games to be able to beat that kind of rake and walk away with much profit.
Alternatively you could play and I would recommend (in fact I did to someone else last night) playing HU SnGs. The rake is 5% on all games which isn't as great as some sites but much better than DYMs, you're still doubling your money same as a DYM but paying one third of the rake to do it (so the ROI is much better), playing terrible opponents and getting through games 10 times quicker.
I think it's pretty easy to develop a style to beat the low stakes HU SnGs on here cos most people that play them are just SO bad. PM if you want for advice, or if you go on FB or Skype, I can play a few HU games and screen share with you so you can see how they play.
smitalol /> 'i know i'm easily better than 99% of the people at this level'
smitalol /> etc
smitalol /> little mong
liamboi11 /> yeah maybe he thinks he better than most but I don`t, cos hes not, so y am i a mug